[PnP] WEapon Courses

[Scott Adams]

This is obvious to me and you.  My point it is not to new folks.  The 
phrasing.
I use 2 dagger skills.
But the way the basic rules imply you should get both.
Get Mace you get all those under it.  Easy.
Then you look at Dagger great you get both.
But then you look at skill table and scratch head.  Why is it 2 
different costs to buy?
But I thought Dagger gives us both?
See?  That confusion is a bit misleading.  Had this one with my new player.
Now that I look at it i cna see why.
Maybe wout should edit it in his great new pd that
Dagger gives you free OEN of the two.
Spear give syou one of the two.
All others you get at el0 as listed.

That's all I'm saying.
A FAQ on this might be useful.
I hadn't even looked at the rules this in depth in years.  When he 
emailed me asking about Courses i was like what????
The term I had to lok up.
Sure enough its there.  Been so long.

First the rules imply that there is this Weapon Course buy cost? So 
his first question is where was the cost forX skill.
Oh?  So its on skill chart But that's one skill.  So that is also a 
bit unclear.

So after figuring out no Course buy in but a Skill buy in he then 
asked why Dagger gives 2 when its 2 different buy ins.

To us this is second nature.
But to new folks it is harder.

In 30 years I can't say how many times I've had to explain the 
Initial increases section. ;)






At 05:57 PM 11/2/2016, you wrote:

>Throwing a dagger and fighting with a dagger are two different 
>skills. Hence two prices. Throwing Axe is listed oddly compared to 
>daggers and spears, but points this out for throwing axes, so I 
>assume it carries over to throwing daggers, which are listed later. 
>And I suspect that throwing Axe was listed as it was on purpose.
>
>A throwing dagger has different stats than a fighting dagger. Hence, 
>even when using it to fight, it's a separate fighting dagger weapon, 
>much as club and mace are different maces. And an Elven versions of 
>both are swords, at least for fighting purposes. I assume throwing 
>an Elven dagger is just a variant of thrown dagger. One requiring 
>it's own learning path.
>
>Spears have two prices as well (fight style and throwing style), so 
>I don't think he got them confused. Light Lance is specifically 
>noted as a special case in which one skill covers both. It seems to 
>be the only such skill that covers both.
>
>Basically, the Combat skill list breaks down style costs by 
>category, while the Weapon Skills list just breaks down the types of 
>weapons in each category, and doesn't need to double list such things.
>
>The fact that Axe and Throwing Axe are listed twice while daggers 
>and spears are not simply means that ONLY throwing axes may be 
>thrown, while all daggers and spears may be. No matter what the 
>dagger is called or how it is designed.
>
>Of course, I use the printed books, v1. If v2 is different, it may 
>be less mistake and more that it was still a work in progress when 
>he died, and incomplete or still in the draft stages.
>
>But that's me. I don't see a mistake in V1. quite the opposite, I 
>noticed Throwing Axe as the odd man out, and assume it meant 
>something. I may well be wrong. I could be reading too much into it, 
>but it seems to make sense to me.
>
>-----Original Message-----
> >From: Scott Adams <longshotgm at comcast.net>
> >Sent: Nov 2, 2016 12:09 PM
> >To: pnp at list.powersandperils.org
> >Subject: [PnP] WEapon Courses
> >
> >
> >   It is fascinating to see the game from a new player today.
> >   I have 2 new players (3rd on way). One who works with me
> >   is brand new to game very new.  So i had to write up
> >   primers and such for him.  The second has played but
> >   has gotten confused on skills.  I don't blame him now
> >   that I look at it.  SKills are so second nature to me
> >   after 30 years i even forgot this stuff.
> >
> >   Weapon Courses
> >
> >     The game lists these weapon courses..
> >
> >
> >Weapon Skills
> >      Weapon skill is initially gained in a specific Weapon Type. The
> >      starting EL, unless a Special event specifies otherwise, is ZERO.
> >      The basic courses that can be learned are listed in the table.
> >
> >Weapon Courses               Course Weapons
> >Axe                      Throwing Axe*, Hand Axe, Axe and Battle Axe
> >Bow                      Bow, Composite Bow, Longbow
> >Crossbow                 Light and Heavy Crossbow, Arbalest
> >Dagger                   Throwing Dagger, Fighting Dagger
> >Heavy Lance              Heavy Lance
> >Heavy Sword              Broadsword, Bastard Sword, Great Sword
> >Light Lance              Lance**
> >Mace                     Club, Mace, Flail, Hammer, Sap
> >Miscellaneous Throwing   Rocks, Bottles, Chairs, Shuriken, etc.
> >Polearms                 Halberd, Poleaxe, Glaive
> >Repeating Crossbow       Repeating Crossbow
> >Scimitar                 Scimitar, Tulwar
> >Spear                    Spear, Javelin, Pike
> >Sling                    Sling, Handle Sling
> >Sword                    Sword, Short Sword***
> >Throwing Axe             Throwing Axe
> >War Staff                War Staff, any pole of usable dimensions
> >Whip                     Whips of varying lengths
> >
> >
> >         Now his confusion was on Dagger.  Why there are Fight
> >         and Thow at 2 costs.  So to the new player I can
> >         see his issue.
> >
> >         First to him he was looking for Course Cost to Learns.
> >         Had to explain that's the basic Skill Cost.
> >
> >         Second had to explain that more than likely Richard
> >         goofed and placed Dagger and Spear wrong.
> >
> >     So Buying Dagger -Fight doesn't as the courses imply give you
> >     throw for free and vice versa.  So there is confusion there.
> >
> >     Maybe we should have a FAQ for this stuff.  In today's
> >     world we should have Youtube videos :)  But the most confused
> >     part to me for new folks is Initial Increases.  I believe
> >     this is on Wout's site.  But explaining that to a new person
> >     is not as easy.
> >
> >   So you guys think Richard goofed or did he intend to say buying
> >   one dagger gives you second? :)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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