[PnP] Shield expertise

[Thomas O. Magann Jr.]

Section 2.1 is starting skills. Page 21 of book 1. The chart you've posted in is from section 2.22

And yes, here is does say per encounter and that success is for scoring dmaage. Not a hit, but damage. Opponent armor can interfere with success, apparently.in this section. Using it at all, success or failure, is considered partial. And yes in this section there is credit for partial success. Also a special definition of success and partial success for shields. 

More over, this section gives multiple awards for partial success, and only a single award for multiple full successes. Which is still better than the later section awards.

The two sections disagree somewhat on how to award expertise in combat. That's why I like to use section reference numbers when I answer such questions on the list. 

It makes me wonder if Book 1 and Book 2 differ on Magic  awards, as well as the way sections 2.22 and 3.31 disagree on combat awards.

-----Original Message-----
>From: Scott Adams <longshotgm at comcast.net>
>Sent: Nov 6, 2016 9:33 PM
>To: " Thomas O. Magann Jr." <tmagann at earthlink.net>, The Powers and Perils Mailing List <pnp at list.powersandperils.org>
>Subject: Re: [PnP] Shield expertise
>
>
>I found this in my pdf converted to text version 
>of book 1 v1.  Keep in mind pdf-text conversoins 
>are not perfect.  Some characters go missing and some plus signs go wacky.
>Maybe this is where he is seeing the comment on partial?
>This is unedited just a cut/past of th esection.  See excepton at bottom
>----
>
>
>
>
>Table 2.1: Expertise Gain
>Skill Type Point Gain
>Combat Skill CDF* 2
>Other Skill 1D10
>Magic Skill See 4.2.1.1
>*See 4.3
>
>
>
>EXAMPLE | A character with EL3 in the Dagger uses it to
>score a hit in a battle. He will gain CDF 2 Expertise points for
>using it in that battle. If a Jeweler succeeds in determining the
>value of a gem he gains 1D10 points towards increasing his skill
>as a Jeweler.
>
>
>
>The points above are gained for Success. For 
>Combat Skills, success is scoring damage. For other skills, success if
>
>
>
>getting the desired result.
>EXCEPTION | Shield users succeed when they block a
>Shield Hit in battle. If their shield is not hit, Partial Success
>will apply.
>---
>That last line?
>v2 it has a few more words but same thing.
>So if partial succ then I guess I can see partial expertise.
>I guess what he means.
>I'm tired (midnight) so this was just a quick scan of files.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>2.2.3 Partial Success
>
>At 09:41 PM 11/6/2016, you wrote:
>>No, 3.31 is clear: Hit or miss, simply USING a 
>>skill in combat grants full expertise. No partial or zero awards, always full.
>>
>>If you have a reference that says otherwise, 
>>I'll give it a read if you can provide a 
>>book/page or entry number, but all I can find is 
>>section 3.311. Again, page 38 of the 1st book. 
>>Now, the rough draft of v2, on the web might say 
>>something otherwise, but I'm using the published v1 rules.
>>
>>Shields are used in combat, hence full expertise 
>>is used, no matter what the result. Even a 
>>failure in combat teaches something. Possibly 
>>more than success does.  This seems to be the 
>>clear intent of combat expertise rules.
>>
>>Now, I can't find a reference to the exception 
>>you list below in book 1 or 2. It's quite 
>>possible I missed it, but I'm thinking that 
>>you're expressing an opinion, which is fine. I 
>>was simply stating what the rules actually said. 
>>That was the intent of the original question, I believe: What do the rules say?
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: David Sanders
>>Sent: Nov 6, 2016 6:17 PM
>>To: pnp at list.powersandperils.org
>>Subject: [PnP] Shield expertise
>>
>>Thomas...I don't think you are correct on one 
>>point, but correct on the expertise award being per encounter.
>>
>>For weapons, there is partial expertise if there 
>>were no hits scored but the skill was used.  The 
>>unlucky character then gets one expertise 
>>point...and it's called a partial 
>>success.  There seem to be no 'failures' for 
>>weapons (I assume being cut down is its own form of failure😃).
>>
>>Shields are slightly different:
>>
>>"EXCEPTION — Shield users succeed when they 
>>block damage. If the shield is not hit Partial Success applies.
>>So, for shield hits you get the CDFx2 
>>expertise...But it doesn't really address 
>>failure.  This may be on purpose as with other 
>>combat skills. I don't know. But to me, I could 
>>understand an enemy getting a swing and a miss 
>>possibly being influenced by the shield use...so 
>>a partial expertise is earned.  But then taking 
>>a hit would also provide the shielded character 
>>an expertise point same as being missed?  Seems 
>>odd.  But it could be the intent too.  I can see 
>>where getting whacked might encourage you to better shield use.
>>
>>Sent from my iPad
>>
>>On Nov 6, 2016, at 2:53 PM, 
>><mailto:pnp-request at list.powersandperils.org>pnp-request at list.powersandperils.org 
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>>>Today's Topics:
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>>>   1. Shields and expertise (David Sanders)
>>>   2. Re: Players Wanted - Possibly for the last time? (Curtis Aikens)
>>>   3. Re: Shields and expertise ( Thomas O. Magann Jr.)
>>>   4. Re: Shields and expertise (Scott Adams)
>>>   5. Re: Players Wanted - Possibly for the last time? (Scott Adams)
>>
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